# Shift Testing Left! **URL:** \ **Category:** Discussions\ **Tags:** learning, process, career-development\ **Created:** [12 February 2024 12:42 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031 "2024-02-12T12:42:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![msh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e19b73/32.png) [@msh](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/msh)\ **Post date:** [12 February 2024 12:42 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/1 "2024-02-12T12:42:48Z")
Not a question so much as a share. I came across this video and I really like it. It discusses “Shifting Left” in testing and demonstrates actionable steps to take in embracing an organizational testing mindset [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/MllB-t_a0LI/maxresdefault.jpg "Shift Left in Software Testing") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MllB-t_a0LI) ---
**Author:** ![sebastian\_solidwork](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/club.ministryoftesting.com/sebastian_solidwork/32/11076_2.png) [@sebastian\_solidwork](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/sebastian_solidwork)\ **Post date:** [12 February 2024 14:16 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/2 "2024-02-12T14:16:25Z")
Despite that I disagree on some point I see him more talking about “expand left” instead of “shift left”, on which I agree on in general. I frequently test whatever is available on feature branches when a developer says he has pieces done which makes sense to interact with. We talk about where I should look and where not because he has not finished it so far. As I work in a Scrum team I’m at every refinement and planning and ask questions and contribute my experience and knowledge. I’m not happy about the advertisement at the end. I was left with the impression, that the previous part was meant to lead to that tool. It might be more of coincidence than causality, but I do not get a good impression by that. I have added all of this also as comment at the video. ---
**Author:** ![msh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e19b73/32.png) [@msh](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/msh)\ **Post date:** [12 February 2024 14:22 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/3 "2024-02-12T14:22:53Z")
I think the “shift” versus “expand” might be either a semantic choice or a german to english choice. If “Expand” works to articulate it better for a person or a team, I think its fine. It did feel a little like “oh hey go get this tool” But I also extracted the _how_ this tool would play a role in this Expand Left strategy. In my org we are shifting from Jira to Linear and I am looking at similar tools to fill the same role. ---
**Author:** ![sebastian\_solidwork](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/club.ministryoftesting.com/sebastian_solidwork/32/11076_2.png) [@sebastian\_solidwork](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/sebastian_solidwork)\ **Post date:** [12 February 2024 14:25 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/4 "2024-02-12T14:25:57Z")
> [@msh](#): > > I think the “shift” versus “expand” might be either a semantic choice or a german to english choice. If “Expand” works to articulate it better for a person or a team, I think its fine. I read critics on this from native speakers too. Interesting that you company move away from Jira. The first in a long time I hear something like that. 🙂 Most times it is the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![ipstefan](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/club.ministryoftesting.com/ipstefan/32/8279_2.png) [@ipstefan](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/ipstefan)\ **Post date:** [12 February 2024 16:31 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/5 "2024-02-12T16:31:56Z")
Where do the 85% of issues introduced in coding come from? Is there a study, on what products, what was measured, what testing was done, and where, what does an issue represent? ‘software testing starting too late’ & ‘cost of fixing issues’: - The cost might be outweighed by the revenue gained; - The cost of fixing a bug can be high, but it doesn’t mean that we have to, want to, or will fix it; ‘Testing earlier will reduce this number’ - it could reduce some issues, if anyone would listen to and act on the information given by the ones testing, and if the testing done is appropriate. I would say responsible Shift Left and contextual measures make sense. But don’t go following specific trends/patterns, or measures of testing as these might destroy relationships with other departments, lose contracts, get forced process changes to speed up things, have pressure from C level, decrease revenue, decrease credibility with clients, and so on. ---
**Author:** ![msh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e19b73/32.png) [@msh](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/msh)\ **Post date:** [13 February 2024 12:20 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/6 "2024-02-13T12:20:22Z")
Excellent points. I dont think there is such a thing as “testing too late”. I also think that there is no such thing as a “perfect” paradigm. Like anything, you can do too much or lean too hard on a thing. A laser focus on “Shift Left” could mean that post-release is ignored until smoke is boiling out of the server room. Or worse, customers are quitting and you dont know why. I admit to being ignorant of a lot of these kinds of concepts like “Shift Left/Right” at least in any formal sense. I understand them from experience rather than education effort. Ive been heads down grinding out defects for a long time. This is actually the first QA community Ive found that has been valuable to me. ---
**Author:** ![sebastian\_solidwork](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/club.ministryoftesting.com/sebastian_solidwork/32/11076_2.png) [@sebastian\_solidwork](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/sebastian_solidwork)\ **Post date:** [13 February 2024 13:45 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/7 "2024-02-13T13:45:06Z")
I like this differentiation from James Bach: ![image](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/uploads/ministryoftesting/original/2X/3/3ccf60b760e468ab514613c0d0f919ea3527173d.jpeg) > **[James Bach on LinkedIn: This is a concept that occurred to me while teaching...](https://www.linkedin.com/posts/james-bach-6188a811_this-is-a-concept-that-occurred-to-me-while-activity-7127932734584356864-d1ih/)** > > This is a concept that occurred to me while teaching the Rapid Software Testing Managed class. It was immediately improved upon by Joe Sevits. Thanks Joe. > > The… | 45 comments on LinkedIn ---
**Author:** ![msh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e19b73/32.png) [@msh](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/msh)\ **Post date:** [13 February 2024 14:12 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/8 "2024-02-13T14:12:45Z")
Interesting. I will have a look at that. Bach is often a good read. Based solely on the graphic it seems to align with identifying tests as “Must, should, could and wont” (which as I read that statement, I realize its probably incredibly ignorant 😃 ) ---
**Author:** ![simon\_tomes](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/club.ministryoftesting.com/simon_tomes/32/14009_2.png) [@simon\_tomes](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/simon_tomes)\ **Post date:** [13 February 2024 15:11 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/9 "2024-02-13T15:11:18Z")
Hey @dnlknott. Cool to see one of your videos shared here. Feel free to jump into the conversation. ---
**Author:** ![dnlknott](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/club.ministryoftesting.com/dnlknott/32/4710_2.png) [@dnlknott](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/u/dnlknott)\ **Post date:** [4 March 2024 11:59 UTC](https://club.ministryoftesting.com/t/shift-testing-left/74031/10 "2024-03-04T11:59:21Z")
Thanks for the heads-up Simon. Missed to reply, too many things happening right now :).