This is very good, Kate, thanks 
Iāll just have to put my imagination to workā¦
it is very helpful info!
Thanks!
1-2 pages maximum. Focus on roles in last 3-5 years at most (nobody cares what you did 10 years ago) and talk about achievements (I did X, the outcome was Y) rather than list responsibilities.
Iāve only worked in one testing role, but been in it for 6 1/2 years, with all previous jobs being unrelated (shop floor jobs in retail).
Are they worth giving role, employer and dates?
If so, it clogs it up with junk.
Without them, it could seem like Iāve not had another job prior to this one.
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I would say that the āunrelatedā jobs depend on what narrative that you want to display. But believe that in the testing world, very few jobs are completely unrelated. Take me for example. After working technical jobs for a long while, I stopped and worked as a retail manager for two years. After that, I stepped even further back and worked āunskilledā labor for two years. Both of those roles are (against professional advice) on my CV. Both roles are often intensely questioned in interviews, despite that it was 15 years ago.
But the conversations are very important to both myself and the interviewer. When they ask āwhy stop with tech for 4 years?ā I can reply about my first stop was to help with an ailing family member, orā¦ I put my family first in my life. The second was because I had moved to a new country where I didnāt speak the language and had to do something to put bread on the table while I funded my further education and created opportunities. This speaks to my risk-taking approach and my ability to plan what will happen if/when the risks donāt pan out. In other words, the gaps speak volumes about who I am, and their reaction to the gaps speak volumes about who I will be working with. i.e. Would they be supportive if/when I choose to put my family life before my professional one? Or could they see the planning and effort (and reward) it took to move to a new country?
On the other hand, the fact that I worked fast food in high school, on production lines in summers, or campus security in college never made it into my CV at any time in my life. I didnāt (and still donāt) see the value of mentioning those jobs in relation to a testing career. They never fit into a narrative which I wanted to talk about more than āI can test thisā. And no interviewer has ever asked what I did prior to leaving university.
So from my perspective as someone who has interviewed for a lot of jobs in the past is that you could write both versions down, then read them back (or better, have a friend/family member/coach read them) and then ask what you would ask about as an interviewer. What does the narrative say about you?
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I really like how youāve put the perspective on this!
I kept a 3 week work placement on my CV until it was no longer relevant. It was hugely relevant in my first 2 jobs in software. That placement was working in a hospital dealing with confidential patient records. My first two software roles were dealing with confidential patient data. I had no other previous experience to show that I fit that job requirement so well so I kept them there.
Iāve always been uncertain about the role I worked while in Uni. Iām personally very proud that I worked my way up from cashier to cash office to supervisory level while working part time and completing studies. Some companies are impressed with that, others are not. For me, it shows that I was able to balance work and studies, progress my career and hold posts of great responsibility (dealing with very large sums of money regularly). Many people tell me to remove it but Iāve always been unsure what to do.
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How to tell the story of you on paperā¦
It seems in Canada they are super keen to know what tools you worked with. I mean I get it no investment in teaching you if thatās their thing, but I see tools as a learning experience and I donāt think it matters if you can use wireshark or Charles. Same crap different day.
I also tailor each submission as company x doesnt care about older experiences that cannot be cross applied; sometimes itās in and sometimes its not.
I once worked with a coach that said intros are a waste of valuable space and gives reason for you to end up in the bin. He talked about activities that land you in the bin and that was his one big one Which brings me to cover lettersā¦ also a binable offense.
He said to use consistent tense, āingā for example. Dont mix them up.
The topic of lengthā¦ no more than 4 pages, if you canāt find whatās important in career based on the job description applying for itās a flag to a recruiter that your thought processes cannot figure out whatās important. I have been on the receiving end of many CVās and will toss then out if you make me sweat.
Spelling, seriouslyā¦ this is the one document that it seriously matters if you are a tester. Iāve binned countless for this. While no one is perfect this is one where perfect is key.
I will also shift sections around depending of how the advertisement is written. If they stress education first, lead with that block if not I go with experience/work history.
We in Canada donāt have photos, age or martial status, its a discrimination thing and laws prevent these things.
A dead give away that you are a new Canadian is the photo.
Now after all that, you need to leave them wanting to know more about youā¦ thatās how you land the interview!
Sorry to necro the thread (I searched for recruitment for advice), but I figured I might be able to offer some advice as Iām going through the interview process at the moment (although Iām now worried that this might flavour ones I getā¦). Other prospective employers will obviously vary ā I can only speak about things I consider.
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I like to know at least something about the person. I like to know if someone collects Nintendo Game and Watch handhelds or did a wheelie the length of Hadrianās Wall. It gives me some idea of personality, and weāre looking for someone who fits our culture. Technical skills can be taught, being a pleasure to work with, less so.
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Inflating your importance at previous jobs can look ridiculous. Cashing up tills at the end of the day is not managing a shops accounts.
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Donāt add buzz words, especially not because you saw them on our website - be assured that I will raise them as topics for conversation in the interview, and if you give me a blank look when I ask or show a misunderstanding of the topic, itāll be obvious. If someone says on their CV, for example, that they are experienced in Agile and Waterfall, Iāll ask them to talk about the pros and cons. Iām not so interested in a right or wrong answer as I am seeing if thereās at least some sort of understanding there.
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Spelling and grammar. Part of your job will be checking this, so if your CV is full of mistakes, it wonāt help your cause. The odd one, Iāll let go, for example, apostrophes after initials when itās not a possessive is sadly incredibly common now. If anything suggests you havenāt re-read your CV at least once before sending it, it really wonāt help - Iāll assume that you donāt have the attention to detail I expect, or you sent it off without thinking (Iāve done this myself - after particularly bad days at an existing job, Iād get home and rattle off applications without proof-reading).
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I know I mentioned not adding buzz words because youāve seen them on our site, but if thereās something that suggests your CV is individually tailored is cool.
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Showing that you havenāt read the job spec is pretty much inexcusable. If it states that you are expected to work from the physical location and you ask about remote working, thatās a quick route to the bin.
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Iāll always be happy to get CVs from MoT, as it may suggest an engagement with testing outside of your daily job (interview related, not CV, I love seeing someoneās eyes light up when talking about testing, and I like to think I can tell this is genuine).
Hope that helps. I may write an article about my recruitment process once Iāve finished this round of recruitment ā I donāt want to have people just āfaking itā.
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Hi Chris, one thing Iāve heard quite a few times particularly from @betterallies on Twitter is referring to people who are ānotā a culture fit could be a warning sign that they are not considering if they could be a culture add. Diverse teams are better for everyone be that background, culture, ethnicity or personality such as being on the autistic spectrum. Iām definitely not saying thatās what you are doing, I just thought it worth highlighting.
Since I posted my CV in this thread Iāve also removed my picture as its use might be seen as leveraging my privilege.
I look forward to your write up which sounds really useful to lots of people.
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Definitely not what I meant! I should have expanded my point, so apologies. Without wanting to devolve into cliches, we are an incredibly friendly, welcoming and diverse bunch here (thereās even a West Bromwich Albion fan). I more meant that if someone were potentially unpleasant, that would be a concern.
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The one time I had a rejection that said that I was āa poor cultural fitā to the office, it was from a company where the testing team was perhaps the most monocultural office Iād set foot in for twenty years. Except for one thing: I was older than everyone I saw there. Of course, that sort of thing isnāt legal in the UK these days (but just try proving itā¦), so I usually see āpoor cultural fitā as shorthand for something far less acceptable.
Eventually, I ended up with a software house where I am far and away the oldest person in the test team, and itās been a revelation - theyāve taught me more about testing in two-plus years than I ever learnt in the preceding twenty. At the same time, Iāve passed on the fruits of my knowledge about business in the real world, and how that influences the way users actually interact with software products. I suspect that was the companyās plan all along.
I feel like Iāve dug myself a hole by trying to frame something in an overly simplistic way. Iām regretting posting it now, to be honest. All I was trying to do was help people to write CVs, and to say was that we look for people that are not unpleasant, and are willing to learn,. Those things you hint at by saying āless acceptableā are never a reason weād consider as a reason not to employ someone. As for age, I was in my 40s when I was employed. The only problems that causes are when I make cultural references and get blank looksā¦
Donāt regret posting. Itās very important that we all know that some phrases (like Cultural Fit) are very loaded to some people.
Your initial post and the follow up were also, to put it bluntly, brilliant.
So you done good. Thanks
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Hi Chris, please accept my apologies if I made you feel bad in anyway which was not my intention. It was more a general comment on being aware of culture fit being used as a way of blocking people ānot like usā. I thought Iād been clear with the line below but thatās on me to try to be clearer in future.
Iām definitely not saying thatās what you are doing, I just thought it worth highlighting
I completely take your point regarding āunpleasantā people. You are definitely not in a hole and you are helping people. As generally the āoldest person at the conferenceā, a nickname given to me by my partner when she came with me to Agile and Automation Days in Poland last year, Iāve seen first hand those comments about fit when they mean they are worried the old guy wonāt be able to keep up!
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Iām sorry too. I was getting a bit sensitiveā¦
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Cultural fit doesnāt necessarily mean that all people in the company should have the same interests or like the same things. Diversity is welcome, but there are situations where some people simply wonāt fit, and itās ok to say no if thatās the case.
We have had one dev that was cultural mismatch for the whole company and yet management tried to keep him because he was very good. He never attended team building activities, constantly complained about noise (open office) and other people, hated internal meetups, etcā¦ It wasnāt pleasant experience having him around, especially for us who worked on the same projects with him. In the end he decided to quit himself.
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Chris, I certainly wasnāt trying to be critical of either you or the company you now work for. Getting a good fit to the rest of the team is pretty important: the company Iām with now take a very broad view about cultural diversity in particular, because weāre building products that are going to be used all over the world by staff in universities of all sizes and sorts. We have to be culturally diverse because our target customers are equally diverse, in needs, backgrounds and experiences.
As for age: I was 58 when I went through my last bout of unemployment and rehiring. And I certainly get the blank looks with cultural references thing! The last one was the phrase āsent to Coventryā (for non-Brits, a form of ostracization through personal isolation in the workplace as a peer-imposed punishment for some transgression or other) which my younger colleagues were completely unaware of. The funny thing is that we are based in Coventry.
Sadly, though, the unacceptable practices I mentioned in my last post do happen, much as weād like to think that they are dying out.
Bringing the discussion back to CVs, I covered the problem of how to highlight key features of my career that donāt fit neatly into a testerās career narrative by putting the good bit first - starting with a combination of personal statement and key achievements from a career that hasnāt all been about testing. I was able to draw out ten very varied highlights that showcased the range of my experience. This was intended to do two things: catch the eye and pique the interest of someone who was interested in people; and hopefully actively discourage anyone only looking for a cookie-cutter candidate. Desperate as I was for a job, I knew that my skills set was a bit unusual, and there was little point in my pursuing applications with companies who wanted applicants with a standard set of well-defined but āvanillaā qualifications. I worked on the basis that those who would reject my application on those grounds were probably companies I would not want to work for anyway.
The strategy was good enough to get me sixteen interviews in just under six months and was ultimately successful.
But a CV can only tell you so much about someone. In the end it has to come down to meeting on a one-to-one basis before you can decide if a candidate is going to fit in with the rest if the team. Then weāre into exploring the dynamics of interviews, and thatās a whole different subject.
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Was gunna make another thread, but saw this one already exists.
Some good stuff here, but it seems to centre around you already having achieved cool things, like listing your achievements a la Kate, who had done a bunch of stuff. But what if you havenāt been the sole tester of a multi million dollar project, and you havenāt maintained virtual machines or 1/2 million lines of code? What if youāre just a noob tester who learns a lot and does pretty ok considering the time theyāve spent in the role and the lack of guidance/resources? What if youāre actually on paper a pretty rubbish tester, but you know youāre super awesome, but on paper youāre not?
I might be looking for another role soon, and I think I have the most uninspiring cv/resume in the world. Iāve had feedback on it in the past, but mainly around the layout, not the contents. How would you recommend that a fairly average tester without years and years of experience write a cv that will get the attention of companies where theyāll have the opportunities to do the cool stuff all yāall are doing and writing about in your cvs?
Iāve done loads of things, donāt get me wrong, but not enough of any of them to make it worth writing out. āI played around with a bunch of things and now I can better pretend I know what Iām doingā doesnāt feel like it would work haha.
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How about a cover letter? That gives you the opportunity to talk about things you have learned etc. and your CV is there as the formal/mandatory element. Plus, it shows you have put more effort into your job search by including a cover letter, as not everyone does that.
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Bruce, I can only suggest that you have a look at some of the non-testing things that you have done and think of ways to draw points from them that an employer would notice. They donāt need to relate 100% to testing ability, but you just need enough so that you make it past the various gatekeepers. In small companies, those gatekeepers are likely to be the actual managers who you will be working with, so an achievement thatās a bit quirky and off-the-wall and yet relatable to a desirable business skill will make your CV stand out from the others. In larger companies, your CV will have to be more bog-standard so that it allows the HR people to tick the boxes and assess you against their checklist, saving the more personal stuff for further down in the detail.
And I second Faithās comment about cover letters. If the employer has a standard form that they want CVs submitted in, that can sometimes exclude the more personal stuff, so the cover letter is the place to get that in there.
You also need to find a way of expressing things like āI played around with a bunch of things and now I can better pretend I know what Iām doingā in business-speak. How about āI have applied a range of exploratory and experiential techniques in different situations to give me better insights into user and system behaviours and their interactionsā ? 
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